At this year's Women In Music Awards, we celebrated the achievements of 13 game-changing executives and artists as the industry came together to honour their work. Music Week has spoken to all 13 winners to tell their stories.
Words: Charlotte Gunn
In March of this year, Talia Shabatai was promoted to director of legal and business affairs at Island Records, and now, just months later, she has won the Rising Star Award at Music Week’s Women In Music Awards.
Back in March, Shabatai, who joined Island as an intern in 2016, said she was “honoured to continue to work at such a special label, with its unrivalled heritage and cultural significance, and feel a great privilege to be part of its future”.
She also paid tribute to her predecessor in the role, Claire Sugrue, calling the executive “best in the business”.
Island EMI president Louis Bloom said Shabatai has “developed into a truly invaluable member of the senior team and has helped steer Island through the fast-changing world of the music business in general and business affairs in particular.”
“As well as her outstanding legal expertise, Talia is a wonderful human being, a person of utmost integrity and an Islander through and through,” Bloom added.
Without further ado, Music Week presents our interview with Shabatai, in which she traces her journey through the industry and talks about mentorship, the truth about working in legal in the music industry, representation and more…
What does it mean to win the Rising Star award?
“It was a real shock. I didn’t know that I was put forward so it was really lovely. Working in business affairs and legal, it’s not always the most recognised department at these kinds of things, so it’s just nice to be considered.”
You joined Island as an intern in 2016. Did you have any aspirations in terms of working at the label at that point and what were your first impressions?
“I didn’t know for sure that’s what I wanted when I went into it. I’d obviously done a law degree and I knew I wanted to be in media generally – and in house – so I was looking at roles specifically in TV, film and music to just see what I liked. I was super young, 21, so I was still working it out. It sounds cheesy, but from the first day of the internship I absolutely adored it and was like, Okay, this is what I want to do and where I want to be for my whole career.’ And I never left!”
Do you remember what made it feel so exciting?
“All the people were just so fun and dynamic. I remember going up in the lift and people were introducing themselves and showing me around and being so friendly and great. I enjoyed my law degree, but I knew I didn’t want to just be surrounded by lawyers. I liked the fact that I was surrounded by all these amazing creatives.”
It’s one of those rare industries where people are doing it genuinely for the love of it and not because it’s a 9-5
Talia Shabatai, Island
Did you get a feel for the music industry during your internship? What did you make of it?
“You definitely felt the youth in the room, that there were lots of people running the company who were relatively young. It felt vibrant. It can be a bit of a madhouse – lots of eccentric characters walking around – but you feel the passion that people want to be there and it’s their calling. It’s one of those rare industries where people are doing it genuinely for the love of it and not because it’s a 9-5.”
You're one of the youngest heads of business affairs in the industry - how do you reflect on what you've achieved so far? Do you see yourself as a role model for other young women?
“I don’t know if I’ve got that far yet! But part of what comes with winning this award is looking back on the beginning. If you’d told me when I was an intern that I was going to be in this role, I wouldn’t have believed it. I really, really admired my boss, Clare Sugrue, who was such a strong female mentor to me from day one. She’s an exceptional, impressive woman who has had an absolutely legendary run in the industry. I’m beyond proud of myself to step into those shoes. But yes, I am surrounded by quite a lot of people doing this job who are quite a bit older than me and with that comes slight imposter syndrome, but mostly, I’m just incredibly proud of myself.”
How much did having Claire as a boss help prepare you for the role?
“It’s obviously quite a male-dominated industry but it’s also an incredibly male-dominated sector of the industry. Most of the senior lawyers and partners are men, so she was leading the charge as a strong female presence in that area for years. To see her do it and command a space and a negotiation straight away was so inspiring. I was lucky that she was the person that hired me and taught me. She showed me what’s possible. Who knows what would have happened if it had been someone different.”
What has been the biggest obstacle or challenge you've faced so far and how have you handled it?
“In the early days it was that I was still studying while I worked. Getting my training in, getting all my exams done whilst working full time was super challenging. Training in house is quite unique – there's not that rigid training program, so you have to actively make sure you're learning at the same time as just getting the job done. Connected to that is moving through the gears of the company. Everyone here has been really, really supportive and championed me. But obviously, to go from intern to someone quite senior, especially as a woman, it definitely took a while to not be seen as the paralegal intern and to to be taken seriously as the second in command for a number of years, and now head of the department.”
Talia Shabatai with Universal Music UK CEO & chairman Dickon Stainer (left) and Island EMI president Louis Bloom (right)
Do you have any tips or advice for people who have risen quickly through the ranks, regardless of what sector of the industry they’re in?
“Just trust in yourself that you know what you’re doing, project that and be confident. It’s also important to set boundaries. It’s easy for people to continue asking you to do administrative tasks because you were good at them when you were junior. You may have to ruffle feathers by saying, ‘Sorry that’s not my role anymore,’ but you have to do that, otherwise you’re better off moving companies, to be seen in a different light. But I do believe there really is scope to progress at one company like I have, you just have to put yourself out there.”
Can you name your proudest achievement at Island?
“It has to be getting this promotion. I’ve had a lot of achievements – closing deals and stuff – but to find out I was going to be stepping into Claire’s shoes when she left the company felt like such a huge achievement. I still don’t really believe I’m doing it. And the fact that Louis Bloom and Adam Barker put their faith in me to do it when I’m relatively more junior than a lot of people in my position was a real honour.”
People often say that the most important thing a new artist can do is make sure they have a good lawyer. Can you shed any light on why this area of the business is so important? People don't often talk about the legal stuff!
“The deal making is often forgotten about because it’s before the artist is at a certain level but it really is the DNA for the artist’s time at a label or management company. It really sets out the stall and dictates how things go – what music you're delivering, how you’re interacting with the label, what your remuneration is. So it’s important to get that deal right and it’s important to have the right people make that deal.”
You've talked about working with Claire Sugrue - how important are role models in music, across the industry?
“Having strong female mentors in the industry is so important so other women can see what’s possible. There's still a lot of work to do in terms of the representation of women in senior positions. The more, the better. We need to see more women come through companies and stay there and get to those senior positions. That can be a rarity. It's so important to see that companies are championing women to progress through – particularly once they've had kids as well. I think that's so important.”
You co-founded The Alliance, Island's internal support network. How do you think that has helped your colleagues and what kind of support have you needed so far as a young exec?
“It was born out of some things that were coming to light about women’s experience in the industry and we just realised that there wasn’t really a network or support system internally. There are lots of amazing initiatives that happen at Universal and in the wider industry, but just for our label in particular, we wanted to make sure there was a safe space where women could talk about anything, whether it be trivial or important. I have some really great female friends at the label who I’m so grateful for, who are always there to listen. The more senior I get, the more I notice the obstacles of being a woman in the industry. A lot of it’s quite subtle, but you just come up against it a bit more. So I’m grateful for the females in my life at work that I can go to for support.”
What are your personal aspirations for the future? And your hopes for the industry more widely?
“It feels quite undetermined at the moment. You work towards something and then you want to enjoy it. So I’m really trying to hone my skills in this role, establish myself and enjoy it – so far, so good – and then think about next steps in a year or so. But really, I just want a long lasting career in the music industry. In terms of my hopes for the industry, I hope to see more women come through and stay there. You see a lot of women in junior positions and you don’t see enough make their way through and stay there once they’ve had children. So I want to see more support for women to pave their way.”
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